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How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Old Aug 13th 2004, 7:50 pm
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Default How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

A friend of mine was residing illegally here, but later he adjusted his status and currently waiting for his N-400 interview. He didn’t know until today when he got a reply from Selective Service System stating:
“We have received your inquiry concerning your eligibility for a right, benefit, or privilege which is subject to your registration with the Selective Service System. A search of our files, and an examination of the information you provided reveal that you were required to register with Selective Service, but you have not registered. -------- -----------

------- --------- ---------- --------------
Any explanation to justify your failure to register must me made to the agency administering the right, benefit, or privilege you seek. You should submit this letter to them for consideration along with a copy of any documentation you believe may be helpful to your case. The final decision regarding your eligibility is with the authority of that agency. “

Sincerely,


I also checked the following sites http://www.sss.gov/must.htm and confirmed that a person residing illegally in the U.S is also required by law to register with Selective Service System. So in the ( N-400 ) interview if he says he was not aware of the fact that he was required by law to register, would that be a good excuse or what better way can he answer this question. How his failing to register with Selective Service System will affect his entire Naturalization process? Any advice, suggestion will be appreciated.

Thanks
Choyty
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Old Aug 16th 2004, 7:32 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

So there is no one in this forum who has encountered this situation? Is my friend's situation a unique one? Or may be USCIS doesn't make big deal out of it if one says " I didn't know that I had to register being an undocument alien " that's why no one is paying that much attention. Please share your exp if you or any one you know has gone through this situation.

Thanks
Choty
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Old Aug 16th 2004, 8:13 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Originally Posted by choyty
So there is no one in this forum who has encountered this situation? Is my friend's situation a unique one? Or may be USCIS doesn't make big deal out of it if one says " I didn't know that I had to register being an undocument alien " that's why no one is paying that much attention. Please share your exp if you or any one you know has gone through this situation.

Thanks
Choty

Yes he was suppose to register. However, he didn't and the reason he didn't is because he didn't know he had to. I would NOT add the words about being an undocumented alien. No need to rub it into the face of the examiner that he was here illegally for a number of years and now is being the offered the privilege of becoming a citizen of a country whose laws he abused.

What else can he say to the examiner at the time of his exam and interview?

And yes, it could be a reason to deny naturalizatio but will it? Unlikely.

Last edited by Rete; Aug 16th 2004 at 8:17 pm.
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Old Aug 16th 2004, 8:16 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Originally Posted by choyty
So there is no one in this forum who has encountered this situation? Is my friend's situation a unique one? Or may be USCIS doesn't make big deal out of it if one says " I didn't know that I had to register being an undocument alien " that's why no one is paying that much attention. Please share your exp if you or any one you know has gone through this situation.

Thanks
Choty
Not that many undocumeted aliens I would guess on this board.

And do you not have to be under 26? at the time for it to be an issue?

Sounds like he needs a lawyer.
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Old Aug 16th 2004, 8:20 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Originally Posted by Boiler
Not that many undocumeted aliens I would guess on this board.

And do you not have to be under 26? at the time for it to be an issue?

Sounds like he needs a lawyer.

It is an issue even with documented aliens. There are quite a few K-1 or K-2 or even K-3 visaholders who are in the US and under the age of 26 and fail to register with the selective service. Then the question pops up when they go to naturalize and find out OMG I was suppose to do? Or they do know and they don't want to even encounter the slightest chance of being drafted if the draft is reinstated in the US.
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Old Aug 17th 2004, 8:43 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Originally Posted by choyty
A friend of mine was residing illegally here, but later he adjusted his status and currently waiting for his N-400 interview. He didn’t know until today when he got a reply from Selective Service System stating:
“We have received your inquiry concerning your eligibility for a right, benefit, or privilege which is subject to your registration with the Selective Service System. A search of our files, and an examination of the information you provided reveal that you were required to register with Selective Service, but you have not registered. -------- -----------

------- --------- ---------- --------------
Any explanation to justify your failure to register must me made to the agency administering the right, benefit, or privilege you seek. You should submit this letter to them for consideration along with a copy of any documentation you believe may be helpful to your case. The final decision regarding your eligibility is with the authority of that agency. “

Sincerely,


I also checked the following sites http://www.sss.gov/must.htm and confirmed that a person residing illegally in the U.S is also required by law to register with Selective Service System. So in the ( N-400 ) interview if he says he was not aware of the fact that he was required by law to register, would that be a good excuse or what better way can he answer this question. How his failing to register with Selective Service System will affect his entire Naturalization process? Any advice, suggestion will be appreciated.

Thanks
Choyty
Forgive me for seeming naive, or indeed stupid! But if a person is an illegal alien in the USA, how can that person simply apply for adjustment of status and actually expect to be given naturalization? Surely that person should be deported for having overstayed? I always assumed that if you overstayed your welcome and became an illegal alien, that if the authorities found out, you would be deported asap? Maybe I'm missing something here, anyone out there who can enlighten me, please do so!
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Old Aug 17th 2004, 8:55 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Well there are some circumstances where it can be 'forgiven'

But it did strike me as odd that if you are illegal you have to sign up for the draft, just wondered how many did, if any?

Sort of says come and get me.
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Old Aug 18th 2004, 2:45 am
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Thanks Rete and Boiler.

DebraJulia-----My friend was undocumented for a while. Later he was able to adjust his status under 245i, which allowed undocumented alliens to adjust their staus without leaving the country by paying a higher processing fee. I think that law was valid until 1997, and was reinstated for few months in the beginning 2000 to April 2000. ( it shold be between those time frame. correct me if I am wrong ). May be you are not aware of this fact. He did break law by over staying his visa, but at the same time he also used law to become a LPR ( Lawfull Permanent Resident ). I think many people used that window of opportunity to adjust their status. Anyway, now he is a LPR, and we are not disscussing his legal staus, etc. As Broiler mentioned :
Originally Posted by Boiler
Well there are some circumstances where it can be 'forgiven'
But it did strike me as odd that if you are illegal you have to sign up for the draft, just wondered how many did, if any? Sort of says come and get me.
very few illegal people know about it, and very few of them will dare to register out of fear.

Now as he is waiting for his interview, does any one have any better suggestion how to answer this question during interview.

Thanks

Choty
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Old Aug 18th 2004, 3:07 am
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Well would not every person under the age who took advantage of this be in the same position? assuming they want to be a USC.

I do not know the answer but there must be a whole class of people hitting the same issue at this time. Hopefully an Immigration Lawyer would, they have www.aila.com and presumably share case stories.
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Old Aug 18th 2004, 6:01 am
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400

Boiler wrote on 8/17/2004 13:55:
    >
    > But it did strike me as odd that if you are illegal you have to sign up
    > for the draft, just wondered how many did, if any?

The law is written in this way.
It basically says that all males between the ages of 18 and 25 (inclusive)
have to register for Selective Services. Excempt are only males in legal
non-immigrant status. That has the side-effect that illegals have to
register.

A little Google search brought up this gem:
http://www.bpsos.org/LINC/selective_...istration.html
"In brief, the legal opinion states that the failure to register for Selective
Service bars naturalization only if the applicant knowingly and willfully failed
to register during the period for which he must establish good moral character.
If the applicant knowingly and willfully failed to register, but this failure
occurred outside the good moral character period, the failure to register is not
an absolute bar to naturalization, the legal opinion states."
[...]
"The day after the applicant's 31st birthday, the posture of the case changes
again, the legal opinion states. This is because the failure to register will
have occurred outside the period during which the applicant must demonstrate
good moral character. In such cases, the opinion instructs, the INS should first
consider whether the failure to register was knowing and willful. If it was not,
the agency should find the applicant to have satisfied the good moral character
requirement unless other adverse factors are present, the opinion says. Even if
the applicant's failure to register was knowing and willful, that fact would not
be an absolute bar to eligibility...."

And,
"Aliens registering with the Selective Service do not have to disclose whether
they are undocumented. If they voluntarily do so, however, the Selective Service
often passes that information to the INS, according to a Selective Service memo
issued in 1988...."

-Joe
 
Old Aug 18th 2004, 6:01 am
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

Originally Posted by choyty
Thanks Rete and Boiler.

DebraJulia-----My friend was undocumented for a while. Later he was able to adjust his status under 245i, which allowed undocumented alliens to adjust their staus without leaving the country by paying a higher processing fee. I think that law was valid until 1997, and was reinstated for few months in the beginning 2000 to April 2000. ( it shold be between those time frame. correct me if I am wrong ). May be you are not aware of this fact. He did break law by over staying his visa, but at the same time he also used law to become a LPR ( Lawfull Permanent Resident ). I think many people used that window of opportunity to adjust their status. Anyway, now he is a LPR, and we are not disscussing his legal staus, etc. As Broiler mentioned :

very few illegal people know about it, and very few of them will dare to register out of fear.

Now as he is waiting for his interview, does any one have any better suggestion how to answer this question during interview.

Thanks

Choty
Hey thanks Choyty, I had no idea that you could do that. Its great that it has worked out for your friend. Shame other illegals don't know about it, its good for the USA also, that way they can keep track on people and of course earn tax off of their earnings!

I have two sons, I only found about Selective Service because of this forum, other than that, how on earth would u know? The US Government doesn't advertise the fact, do they? So how are u supposed to know? Your friend just has to be honest and stress that he had no idea about the Selective Service but now that he is aware he would willing to place his name on the list.

Last edited by DebraJulia; Aug 18th 2004 at 6:07 am.
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Old Aug 18th 2004, 7:15 am
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400

DebraJulia wrote on 8/17/2004 23:01:
    >
    > I have two sons, I only found about Selective Service because of this
    > forum, other than that, how on earth would u know?

The brochures about Selective Services are displayed quite prominently
in every post office. Have you never stood in line and wondered what this
colorful brochure with the title "Men 18-25: you can handle this" is all
about??? Pick it up the next time you are at the post office...
Also, with respect to your sons, from what I have heard, it is mentioned
in the schools as well.

-Joe
 
Old Aug 18th 2004, 1:52 pm
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400

In article <[email protected]>,
Joachim Feise <[email protected]> wrote:
(snip)
    >The brochures about Selective Services are displayed quite prominently
    >in every post office. Have you never stood in line and wondered what this
    >colorful brochure with the title "Men 18-25: you can handle this" is all
    >about??? Pick it up the next time you are at the post office...
(snip)

There are lots of colourful brochures displayed quite prominently in
every post office, and it's normally my wife who goes anyway while I'm
at work. Even if it comes up in conversation, the reason most
Americans seem to think people have to register is something to do
with funding for college AFAICT, which doesn't apply to me anyway.

At no step in my I-130 process was selective service registration
mentioned anywhere. (I believe it's mentioned in some bit of the I-485
process?) Fortunately, due to this newsgroup, I was aware that I'd
need to register. Otherwise I'd likely not have.

-- Mark
 
Old Aug 18th 2004, 4:09 pm
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Smile Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400

Originally Posted by Joachim Feise
DebraJulia wrote on 8/17/2004 23:01:
    >
    > I have two sons, I only found about Selective Service because of this
    > forum, other than that, how on earth would u know?

The brochures about Selective Services are displayed quite prominently
in every post office. Have you never stood in line and wondered what this
colorful brochure with the title "Men 18-25: you can handle this" is all
about??? Pick it up the next time you are at the post office...
Also, with respect to your sons, from what I have heard, it is mentioned
in the schools as well.

-Joe
Well to be honest, I've never set foot in a USA Post Office! I've only been here since June 04. I saw on the Selective Service website last night that registration is actually completed in High School, a teacher is usually assigned to help students register.
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Old Aug 18th 2004, 5:26 pm
  #15  
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Default Re: How does failing to enroll in selective service affect N-400 interview?

"choyty" wrote:

> A friend of mine was residing illegally here, but later he
> adjusted his status and currently waiting for his N-400
> interview. He didn't know until today [that he should have
> registered with Selective Service]. . . . if he says he
> was not aware of the fact that he was required by law to
> register, would that be a good excuse . . . ? How will his
> failing to register with Selective Service System affect
> his entire naturalization process?

The following web page may be useful:

http://www.shusterman.com/natz-ss99.html

A lot depends on how old your friend is now. If he's 31 or older,
then it probably isn't going to be an issue, because the violation
took place at least five years ago (he technically stopped breaking
the registration law on his 26th birthday, since one can no longer
register at that time). If your friend is married to a US citizen
and is seeking citizenship based on three years of permanent
residence (instead of the normal five years), then his failure
to register shouldn't be an issue if he's 29 or older.

If he's at least 26, but not yet 31 (or 29 if married to a US
citizen), then his failure to register might very possibly be a
problem, and simply saying he didn't know about the requirement
might or might not be accepted as good enough. He would have to
be able to prove that he really, honestly wasn't aware of the law
-- i.e., the assumption will be that he knowingly and willfully
failed to register, and it's up to him to demonstrate otherwise.
In this case, I'd suggest that your friend should discuss the
matter with an immigration lawyer before he has his interview.

If your friend isn't yet 26, then the only acceptable thing for
him to do now is to register now, period. No other action will
be acceptable to the USCIS people if he is still eligible to
register and has not done so.

Rich Wales [email protected] http://www.richw.org/dualcit/
*DISCLAIMER: I am not a lawyer, professional immigration consultant,
or consular officer. My comments are for discussion purposes only and
are not intended to be relied upon as legal or professional advice.
 

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